I’m going to throw some what if’s at you:

What if a person goes on a teen tour. It is very clearly stated that there is zero tolerance for drinking, the kid drinks while on the trip, and then gets kicked off the trip. Do you, as a parent, punish the kid when they get home?

What if the kid was 17 in a country where the drinking age was 18?

What if the kid were 14?

What if the parents lost the entire cost of the trip, plus had to pay extra to change a flight?

What if no money was lost, the kid was just sent home?

What if the amount lost was close to $10,000?

What if the kid was a boy?

What if the kid was a girl?

In a situation where a stated rule is broken, what does a parent do in the situation?

In this hypothetical, my Husband and I had different reactions to the situation, and I wonder if Mother’s feel differently than Father’s.

If this was your kid, what would you do?

For the record- this is not a situation involving my daughter, but may or may not have happened to someone that we know

87 thoughts on “What If…”

  1. No punishment.

    But a lot of questions toward the supervisors if the kid was 14, either gender. Less questions if the kid was 17 but still, you’re trusting the supervisors with the supervision of your kid who is a minor and under the legal drinking age.

    The money? Meh. In my school board the fine print of your responsibility in case of violations of rules would be extensive and we’d accept them because there would be no choice. We’d just pay and refuse to allow further trips out of our pocket to the kid. He or she might view this as punishment but I would call that a consequence.

    With a younger kid, 14 or so, I’d be making a lot of noise first at the supervisors, then question the kid extensively.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

      1. The cancellation of the trip, i.e. being sent home while the classmates continue, is a harsher punishment than anything a parent can dish out. At least that’s how my kids would see it.

        The response to the trouble is going to be unique in each case. Like Deb said, if it’s a one time offender vs this is the usual sort of trouble, or was the kid caught peripherally, i.e. did he or she follow along due to peer pressure, the fallout/consequences/punishment will reflect the situation. There are lot of variables to consider. It’s not black and white to me.

        Liked by 2 people

      2. To me, it’s that I couldn’t trust my kids word. My kid signed a contract with the rules clearly stated. Then they didn’t follow the rules. Can I trust them to drive without texting? This is a safety issue. Add to that, can you trust the kid to make a good decision when they’re not with you?

        Liked by 5 people

      5. I understand, LA, and I agree. Sadly, not all kids respond well to punishments. Meanwhile, consequences, especially natural ones, can sometimes act as punishment without the parent cracking the whip. I’ve seen some strong adjustments to wayward behavior in that way which in some cases worked better than a formal punishment.

        But if course, it depends on the seriousness of the crime.

        A school trip violation of that nature is very serious and I would likely not consent to another school trip of that nature the next time citing trust issues. Would I lock her up in her room and ground her while she’s crying about missing her friends as a punishment? It probably wouldn’t be necessary. Would I take away car privileges for him as a punishment? Maybe. Would that be effective in terms of regaining trust? It would depend on a lot of factors.

        Both my kids react to punishment differently. Neither “learns” any lessons that way and become more resistant to open dialogue, conversation. They shut down after ladi h out. It was counter-effective in my experience.

        Pointing out the consequences of certain infractions and allowing those to manifest has, in my experience, been better at teaching a lesson and adjusting the wayward behavior. But neither of them have committed anything as serious as drinking or drugs on a school trip.

        Liked by 1 person

      6. I get that every kid has to be patented specifically for that kids temperament. But say, your kid texted while they were driving and you found out. Would there be consequences? Or say, the trip was supposed to be for 24 days, cost 10,000 and the kid got sent home on day 3. Would you still think the punishment of I don’t get to see my friends would be enough? Or what if the kid and their two best friends all got kicked off the trip. They get home, you let them hang out?

        Like

  2. Sort of a parental nightmare I suppose. I would want to know if this rule breaking is normal for this kid? Was the kid the only one breaking the rule or the only one caught? What is the monitoring level of a 14 yo versus a 17 yr old… lots of questions I think before deciding on any “punishment”. As to the monetary aspect you sort of have to get your kid home so if the behavior incurs more cost what can you do- leave the kid sitting on the road? I do know I would never pay for another trip for my kid again- that’s a given.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

    1. I figure like this…there are rules for a reason, and if you break a rule, a rule that you signed that you would obey, there should be a punishment. And add to that, the fact that the kid was stupid enough to get caught. To get caught and thrown off a trip requires either a huge amount of stupidity, or, really really violating the rules

      Liked by 4 people

      Reply

      5. Yes, I agree something has to happen, although I like Claudette’s use of the word consequences rather than punishment- but semantics… I suppose the hypothetical parents may be fighting the decision to toss the kid off the trip?

        Liked by 1 person

  3. At my home there would be consequences for breaking a stated rule of the trip. Any penalty would fall on his/her head, even if it took 30 years to repay. A young person needs a healthy respect for rules he agreed to by going on the trip.

    Liked by 7 people

    Reply

  5. I would be more upset if the child was 14 than if they were older BUT I would still be upset at the older one! When rules are firmly stated and you knowingly break them there will be consequences, period! Yes, the child being sent home is a big consequence so I would hope that would teach them. I think I would want the child to pay back some of the money. If they are older and fhey have a job than definitely yes. The younger child would think of an alternative.
    Most of all I would want to make sure that they knew the seriousness of what they did. Its more than just sneaking a drink. Its having no consideration for your parent’s who paid for your trip or the school that is taking you on the trip. It would be rhe attitude that I would be concerned about. Would want to nip the “i can do anything I want” attitude before something more serious happens next time.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

    1. That’s how I feel. It’s the lack of consideration that gets me, and the attitude. With no punishment, how do they learn what should and shouldn’t be done. Actions have consequences

      Like

      Reply

      2. I think that is why it is also important that schools have consequences and follow up on them. There are lots of great kids in schools everywhere but for the few breaking the laws and causing problems, there should be consequences…no questions asked, only rules followed. Admin must stick to the rules and consequences.

        Liked by 2 people

  7. Absolutely punishment when they got home. My goodness, any additional expense would be a hardship on our family and that’s not fair for the rest of us who follow the rules. Definitely no more school related trips. I also might ask where the chaperones were. How was this child able to get alcohol in the first place?

    Liked by 3 people

    Reply

  8. For every action there is a reaction, in this case the child was drinking, underage and against the rules set for the trip. If the reaction is “do nothing” as a parent you’ve lost control. You can never set rules adn expect them to be followed.

    Liked by 3 people

    Reply

      1. It is all down hill. The child will not respect anything you say. I’m not say rule with an iron fist but clearly state the limits and you expectation that they stay within those expectations. I know if I go to work and drink when they have a no drinking rule, I’ll be looking for a new job tomorrow. How is this child going to function in society?

        Liked by 2 people

      2. Right with you. Agree, you don’t rule with an iron fist, but there is an amount of trust forwarded in allowing a kid to do something like this, and it shows disrespect in all manner

        Liked by 1 person

  10. First off Gender doesn’t matter to me. I want my kids to act right and responsibly regardless. Secondly if I trusted you enough to sponsor your journey and allow you to go and then as a Thank you, you break my trust and waste my money. No ma’am!!! I would be pissed. Our trust is broken and the chaperones are about to catch hell on wheels because I’m coming for them.

    Liked by 2 people

    Reply

      1. True they do but I thinnk my nerves and what if’s wouold get the best of me. My mind would spiral to all the what if my child was harmed while being far from me, all the worries that all parents have.

        Liked by 1 person

      2. That’s why the kids sign a code f conduct contract. At some point the kid has to be held responsible. Look at all the stupid rules we have because people don’t listen or use common sense

        Liked by 1 person

  11. Whatever the circumstances are (boy, girl, lots of money, little, 14, 17) I’d react in the same manner. I’d sit my kid down and have a serious conversation about everything leading up to that decision and what really occurred. As I have a pretty close relationship with my kids, and they’ve done nothing this far to break my trust, I’d believe them and work through what happened. They would absolutely work to repay us for extra money lost and we’d talk further about how they can make it right with the other people they let down.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

  12. I’d be angry at both my child and the tour company . First of all it’s against the law to leave a minor unsupervised. No child under 18 is ever supposed to be left alone unsupervised. There should NEVER have been any time a child under 18 was out and about without supervision. Especially in another country. Therefore, said child should have been accompanied by a supervisor (an adult) at all times who would have prevented any alcoholic beverages. The tour group could be sued for letting minors go unsupervised. So they are at fault. End of story. This company is not following legal protocol and should be investigated.

    As a teacher I know what the legalities are for minors. These tours cannot break the law no matter what the parents sign. If parents (not on tour) sign that it’s ok for their child to go to a party and then discover it was unsupervised and drinking occurred it would still be the responsibility of the homeowners who allowed it to happen in their house and they would be charged by the police for letting minors drink.. Under age children need to be chaperoned by an adult. No ands ifs or buts.

    I’m amazed this tour group is in business. It’s against the law for minors anywhere to be unsupervised. So While the child should be disciplined, The teen tour is in the wrong. They don’t get to keep any money because they did not have legal rights to allow children to be unsupervised and get ahold of liquor. If they were chaperoned at all times the drinking wouldn’t have happened.
    So yes, there would be consequences for my child. Absolutely! But, You can bet I’d fight the tour group for lack of supervision of minors. It would never have happened if they had enough counselors for supervision to watch the kids..

    Picture this, schools go on over night trips ALL the time. In order for it to be legal there must be one adult per ten children. That is standard protocol. You cannot leave school grounds, let alone the state without that number of adults and those guidelines are always strictly adhered to. My kids and grandchildren have gone on school trips to Washington DC . Supervision was key. I’m stunned that this company is in business. I’d sue their behinds. “Something is rotten in the state of Denmark”. This company is in violation of certain basic rules and responsibilities. Parents need to understand their rights before allowing their children to leave the country.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

    1. I think you’re being unfair to the chaperones. It’s two or three kids to a room. There’s bed check. Are the chaperones supposed to stand outside the hotel doors making sure the kids don’t sneak out? I think there has to be a level of responsibility that the kid assumes, and signs for on a contract. That’s why there are rules.

      Liked by 1 person

      Reply

      3. Agree!! And if you don’t have your kids accept personal responsibility at.that age than they will be the 30 year old that is still blaming others.
        I will never forget what my child put on their FB page when on a feeding tube, at 13 years old, due to anorexia. Hated the feeding tube but stated how they did this to themselves! That ir was their decisions that caused the feeding tube and how they are the only one who can make it possible to come out! It was one of those breaking my heart, proud mom moments.

        Liked by 1 person

      6. I have a better understanding now of how they are situated . I thought it was a dorm type area. But if the kid is under 18 there is still a responsibility to the owners of the company. . They tell the chaperones what their responsibilities are. I assume all under age kids are housed together. In my mind it was like a college dorm and the floor monitor or chaperone was also also in there with the kids. How is that legal if they are minors? I don’t get it.,I know when students in high school go on trips to Europe or out of state there is always a chaperone in the room. Hotels always put up extra beds. The chaperones are given guidelines to follow. I think whoever runs the place is looking for trouble. Not with drinking but sneaking out. I wouldn’t send my kid if they were under 18 if they didn’t have an adult chaperone at least on the floor. ( for those under 18). I guess being in the “kid business” for so long I know all the things that
        can go wrong and so I think about that kind of stuff. . One time on an over night trip to Disney world a boy snuck out ( boy’s chaperone was parent who left the room). We spent hours searching the Parks after hours and couldn’t find him. The next day we looked everywhere as well. Our buses were delayed. Disney was on high alert. His parents were called and sent for and had to drive up.And everyone was panicked because we could not find him.. Turns out he got sick from eating too much and was taken to a Disney infirmary. What a mess. But the school had to pay extra for the buses being delayed. Parents were freaked out. And while in the end it was ok the school had a mess on their hands. Parents were sued by the bus company… that’s just one time. Another crazy episode with a bad chaperone… we were visiting an alligator farm after going on airboats in the Everglades. A little girl jumped into the alligator pit and got bitten. Each parent had 8- ten kids to watch. The dad who wasn’t paying attention was busy flirting with another chaperone and didn’t see the child jump in with the gators. The girls parents sued the school and won. So yeah, I’ve seen so many accidents I am overprotective because I’ve seen it all. You can’t imagine!

        Liked by 1 person

      7. I’ve never seen it work like you’ve described. And these are very expensive tours. It’s like 2, 3 or 4 kids to a room. That’s the whole purpose of the contract and the clause that if a kid gets caught they’re out. The kids have to take some responsibility

        Liked by 1 person

      8. LA Perhaps the difference is that I live in the South? ( I don’t know.) My kids always had chaperones in their rooms. It was only when they were in college that they were left on their own. This year my grandkids did sleep away camp for a few weeks. They didn’t leave the country but there were constant videos sent home to parents of the kids doing activities, projects,on field trips etc, and even in their sleeping quarters, so I just would expect that tight security . And my friend who took students to Europe every summer sent video files of everywhere they went and their experiences etc. via text. In today’s tech savvy world it’s odd to me that isn’t happening on these teen tours. A video diary taken by counselors daily gives little chance for kids to act irresponsibly. And then the children get used to following an itinerary and following the rules. So I’m surprised. I guess I just wouldn’t be as trusting as you.
        Yes, I would trust my own kids, and they’d face the consequences if they did something in violation, but in general it’s a given that there’s always a few kids who push limits. So I’d think the tour would expect that and prep in advance for it. Yeah parents want their children to act responsibly. (Teachers however, always expect and prepare for the worst), so they have multiple backup plans. Kids are kids and while I love freedom. You can’t be lax if you are supervising other people’s children. I’m just surprised b/c this whole scenario seems unsafe to me. But, I’m used to having strict state guidelines to follow in my teacher’s contract when involving under age children. So….That’s my opinion. I’ve seen way too many things happen. Maybe I am Just too old school. But that’s how Ive always seen it done.

        Liked by 1 person

      9. Well, my daughter did two trips with two different national companies. I think the student to chaperone ratio on her Costa Rica trip was ten kids to one adult, with aboit 3 kids per hotel room. When she did the Stanford thing, I think the christine ration was the same, and they were housed in a dorm, about 4 kids to a room.

        Like

      10. It’s not that I don’t think there shouldn’t be consequences for the kids. I do. And yes, being sent home is appropriate if that was part of the contract I get that. But since I was always in a group of teachers and chaperones taking about 200 kids on trips I’ve never ever heard of trips without a chaperone in every room with the kids. At least if they were under 18. One of my good friend went to Europe every summer with high school kids. Her husband taught high school world history and they accompanied a group every summer. Every single chaperone slept in a room with a group of kids. Why? because kids do crazy things and they were responsible for them. It’s different when students are in college. So I always look at things from the safety side. Years as a teacher I guess.

        Liked by 1 person

      11. This is a teen tour. My daughter went on one a few summers ago and the kids are put up,in hotels. Honestly, I’ve never heard of one where the kids were in rooms with adults. Even when my daughter did an academic program at Stanford, there were four kids to a dorm room, but the adult was at the end of the hall. This is how these programs operate as far as I’ve seen them

        Liked by 1 person

  13. If this were my kid, I would first and foremost make sure he/she was not shamed. I would want it to be a broken rules issue rather than a moral one. I’d want to hear their story, and I’d be remiss not to have a discussion with them about my own foibles, born out of immaturity rather than a character flaw. And then, they’d be completely responsible for the financial costs incurred.
    As for the chaperones, I’d want to hear their side of the story as well, and I’d be grateful my kid was intercepted and home safely.

    Liked by 3 people

    Reply

    1. Shamed? Kids that do stuff like this are hero’s amongst their peers. There’s a thing for the “bad” boys/girls. And I think you’re not giving the chaperones a fair shake. There’s a reason why the kids sign contracts that they will obey the rules, and why there are rules. Say there’s bed check…and everyone is there…in their hotel rooms. Are the chaperones not supposed to sleep, but instead parade past hotel room doors? Then, say the kids get an hour free time at a museum. How do you prevent kids from racing outside and buying alcohol or drugs?

      Liked by 1 person

      Reply

      1. The best way to prevent it would be have a FaceTime conference with the boss, a chaperone chaperone and their child. Together they can discuss if the child gets another chance to prove he/she can behave responsibly from here on out. Personally I’d give the kid one more Chance before sending him packing.

        Liked by 1 person

      2. I don’t think you can do that. The rules are clearly stated, and if you let one kid get away with something, you lose control. I don’t fault the leaders

        Liked by 1 person

  15. I’ve gone back to my own school days with this one and those of my daughters. My first assumption would be that if the student was invited to join the tour they had previously followed school rules and expectations. Why reward trouble with a trip?
    On that basis, if the student broke any rules regardless of age it’s on them.
    And yes, a deduction from their pocket money each week to recover even part of the costs , is better than a lecture from parents particularly if it was a one off indiscretion(fuelled by bravado, peer pressure, whatever….). It’s a lesson in suffering the consequences of poor behaviour.
    As for the chaperones, they can’t stay awake 24 hours a day to supervise. Again, it’s about trust and students understanding the contract. They know the expectations.
    I’ll be controversial here and state some parents fail big time at “parenting”. An overseas tour would be a break for them from their parental responsibilities. They are the ones most likely to bitch about the chaperones.

    Liked by 2 people

    Reply

      1. I think I’d have to check the legalities of the contract, speak to parents and/or students who had been on previous trips, and have my attorney brother read the contract before signing and letting my child attend the tour. The ages of the teens matter regarding the extent of their supervision. For instance, what if a kid goes and that child has a peanut allergy. But informs the group before getting approved for the trip. It’s documented and on file with them. That child can’t room with another child who brings back to their room a granola bar with peanuts. If the group leaders know this ahead of time but somehow peanuts accidentally are put into their room, or handbag, that child can go into anaphylactic shock. Sure it was an accident, but someone’s child could die. So contracts are tricky. There can be exceptions.

        LA in regards to everyone behaving the same way with the consequences Really doesn’t always apply with minors. Because every situation and every kid is different. Stuff happens and each child, each individual case, needs to be handled somehow differently. Yes, generally speaking rules are rules. However, There can always be extenuating circumstances when you are dealing with minors. That’s why when contracts involve minors it’s a slippery slope. With children it’s never black or white.

        One year while doing state testing ( which is timed) a 5th grade girl in class got her period for the first time. (She was wearing white pants). I had to monitor the test, had a proctor as required by law, and so I privately gave the girl a pad, a pair of slacks I had in my drawer, and documented the time she stopped testing to change her slacks etc.. I had to jump through hoops with the state so they wouldn’t invalidate her exam. Crazy stuff happens. Strict protocol is required for testing and I separated her test from the others or the entire class’ exams would be null and void. (Teachers had to sign a special contract before administering the test). There are strict rules. But this was a unique situation. I raised two sons. So pre teen girls getting an early period at that age was a surprise to me. It took months but I was eventually able to get state approval for that child to come back to school and retake the exam. Stuff happens that you can’t always prepare for. I learned that year to keep extra pads and a change of clothing for girls in 4th and 5th grade who might develop early and have their period. (You don’t learn about that when you get your teaching degree). There are always exceptions to the rule).

        Liked by 1 person

      2. All these companies have these contracts, so I’m guessing they’re pretty solid. While I realize there are exceptions, the world has made itself non negotiable. Disney used to allow people with special needs to get a doctors note, and they could skip lines and such. But then people started bringing in fake notes, so disney had to discontinue the policy. People abuse things, and even if it’s only a small percentage, it ruins things for everyone else

        Like

  17. A very tough predicament. Punish? How do you really punish a 17 year old. But, something has to be done, boy or girl, and please notice that I did not say man or woman. They are not there yet. So how do you make this kid accountable is the question. He would have to be made to pay somehow for any money lost. The embarrassment would hopefully be a good lesson. As for the school, the organizers of the trip, sorry, but they get off pretty light here. Any parent, who is worth anything knows that a teenager is a scheming, conniving individual who will plot and plan and come up with some idea that will prevent him from being caught. I know, because I was one. But you have to know your child and what will work. That is called…parenting.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

    1. In this hypothetical, it wasn’t a school, but a tour group specifically for high school students to have either tours or so community service or learn a skill. And what embarrassment? The kid who broke the rule and got thrown out receives a level of cult status amongst their peers…they become the badass who went drinking. The kid becomes a legend

      Liked by 2 people

      Reply

  18. Kids do sometimes make bad decisions and have to live with the consequences. However, I would need to know a lot more about the circumstances. My parents would have gone a bit overboard with punishment (in my mind, anyway). How many kids were involved and where were the chaperones? Peer pressure can really drag down a good kid.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

      1. I was at a hotel in Cleveland during a high school basketball tournament. The hotel manager was terrified of those kids and the chaperones – well, they were invisible. I think that was irresponsible on their part. Someone’s got to take the night shift.

        Liked by 1 person

      2. Don’t get me started on student athletes….those trips are a boondoggle disguised as an athletic tournament…but we allow kids to get away with things with no consequences.

        Liked by 1 person

  19. My daughter went to Spain when she was a senior in high school. There were similar warnings for her trip. There has to be–unless there is one chaperone per student there has to be some minimal level of trust—along with clear behavioral expectations. The drinking age in Spain is 18 so theoretically some of the seniors would have been legal to drink in that country—but the rules of going on the trip were no drinking. I certainly think the chaperones should be vigilant–but I have personally known kids who would have picked up a half empty wine glass when no one was looking and drank it.

    My son was in a situation in high school where he was in a car with someone who had an open container. They were pulled over–everyone had to do a field sobriety test. The one with the open container did not pass. I was livid. We had a big talk with him about how poor choices and hanging around with the wrong people could affect his ability to participate in future school activities.

    I assume those who were kicked off the tour would be ineligible to sign up for future teen tours. The consequences seem like they were clearly spelled out–don’t really feel sorry for the kids.

    Somehow I wonder how I survived getting two kids to “adulthood”. Now I just have to wait til next year when the youngest turns 21–not sure if that is good or bad.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

  20. My daughter went to Paris with her French teacher and other students when she was in high school. I went over the rules with her before she left, and told her that if she got sent home for disciplinary problems, the cost was coming out of her bank account. I really wasn’t worried….my daughter was basically a rules follower….but she was assigned housing with a girl who was definitely not. So I also told the teacher before they left that I wanted to make sure my daughter wouldn’t get in trouble by “guilt by association” if her roommate broke the rules. The teacher totally understood and assured me she would not.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

  22. I saw how a school trip with 16-18 year olds caused a teacher to visibly age over the course of a trip away. He was my daughter’s head of year and someone I’d come to know well. He was absolutely horrified by the behaviour of some of the children in his charge, and I found out from my daughter that the whole party were nearly evicted from the hotel as a result. The troublesome ones were those who’d been totally babied by their parents up to that point and went wild, and some genuinely badly behaved kids whose parents always believed they were angels and that trouble was only ever someone else’s fault.

    In short, I think if this happens, the parents need to take a good hard look at their parenting and figure out how much they’re also at fault.

    Liked by 1 person

    Reply

  23. Do you, as a parent, punish the kid when they get home? NO. Didn’t they already get punished by getting kicked off the trip?

    What if the kid was 17 in a country where the drinking age was 18? Nope.

    What if the kid were 14? Yep. Now we’re doing more punishments.

    What if the parents lost the entire cost of the trip, plus had to pay extra to change a flight? Yep. Now, the kid has to work to pay off his bad decision making.

    What if no money was lost, the kid was just sent home? No punishment.

    What if the amount lost was close to $10,000? The kid will have to work the rest of their life to pay me back.

    What if the kid was a boy? Doesn’t matter

    What if the kid was a girl? Doesn’t matter

    Like

    Reply

    1. I don’t know if they get punished by being kicked off the trip. I’ve seen kids get a cult status as being “that kid”. Also, if my kid was dumb enough to get caught I’d punish them for being stupid

      Liked by 1 person

      Reply

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

Gravatar
WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. ( Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. ( Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. ( Log Out /  Change )

Cancel

Connecting to %s